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The Search For Kane's Baby Mama

Discussion about the original classic Genesis/Mega Drive game. Posts about the GBA remake belong in the forum below.

Re: The Search For Kane's Baby Mama

Postby Caedmonball19 » Sat Nov 16 2013 5:47pm

Tazz119: I have no idea what you are referring to. Please be alot more specific.

Omega: You make a good point about maybe not waking up at the same time. Even with ROTDD we don't see them crawl out of the cryo-sleep we only see them standing together. Who can say that Kane didn't go back for Max. Maybe as the older brother he had his cryo-sleep shorter so he could scout out before his younger brother woke up. I agree that there are some things with ROTDD that conflict but I would argue that there is more that actually confirms and supports the other games to count it out completely.
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Re: The Search For Kane's Baby Mama

Postby Omega Entity » Sat Nov 16 2013 6:41pm

Although, then there's the bit about Kane training Ian to be a leader like Max, and that didn't happen until after cryo-sleep... ugh. It makes my head hurt. Then again, the developers are pretty much know for shoehorning in the plots where they can make them fit. The was no master plan to this series, and so it's really more like a quilt than anything - some of the pieces just might not match up.

Some things do line up, yes, but I really don't see that as justification for using it as anything other than confirming those specific bits, as who knows how valid anything else is in it. Like I said before, it's using Assassin's Creed to write a history paper - some things are the same, but there's far too much that either doesn't line up, or that we have no confirmation of, and therefore should be considered non-canon/useless.
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Re: The Search For Kane's Baby Mama

Postby Caedmonball19 » Sun Nov 17 2013 9:51pm

Omega you are helping my point to a certain degree. if this really is a quilt than whatever we find that fits the quilt should be considered, even if it's not the original quilt. Some things may not fit exactly but whatever does has to be better than me trying to make the fabric from scratch. But to get back on track again:
What are some possibilities of the phrase that Kane trained Ian to be like Max. Does this have to mean physically trained or could this be at he left him letters of guidance, left him with good people? Thoughts or Ideas?
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Re: The Search For Kane's Baby Mama

Postby Omega Entity » Sun Nov 17 2013 10:08pm

Except that I think that's part of what they were trying to do with RotDD, and failed miserably in some aspects. Just because it fits, doesn't mean that it's right, and as the game is developed by those that didn't work on the original games, I feel that's all the more reason to avoid using it.
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Re: The Search For Kane's Baby Mama

Postby DomingoRules! » Mon Nov 18 2013 5:19am

I imagine Kane would've had somebody else train him. He probably knew he'd be facing Darksol himself eventually, and probably wouldn't have wanted Darksol to be able to follow a trail back to finding Ian before Ian was ready. Therefore, Kane probably left somebody, such as a teacher or the mysterious mother, with instructions before distancing himself from them so Darksol would remain oblivious to Ian's existence.

That could be especially true if the prophet also foretold Kane being put under Darksol's control. In that case, then Kane himself probably didn't want to know of Ian's whereabouts, otherwise he may have hunted down and dispatched his own son under the pretense of benefiting Darksol's goal.
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Re: The Search For Kane's Baby Mama

Postby Caedmonball19 » Mon Nov 18 2013 3:37pm

Domingo: I appreciate your insight and agree that this could be a very likely circumstance. What are your thoughts on the prophet telling him 20 years ago? When and how could this have happened in Manarina? I wonder if someone can confirm the translation of that line from Mishaela in SFFC? Is it indeed in Manarina or could it be from Manarina? "From" would be easier to fit into the story. Lastly where do you think Ian and Max would have run into each other? As Max seems to know Ian already when his mask is removed.
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Re: The Search For Kane's Baby Mama

Postby DomingoRules! » Tue Nov 19 2013 8:47am

I'm not really sure if there's enough information to accurately pinpoint the when and how the meeting with the prophet may have occurred. As for Max meeting Ian, I don't recall enough of Final Conflict to say. I only ever played the game once, and all I recall about it clearly was Darksol being the final boss, Odd Eye and Mishaela showing up, the reference to Mephisto, and the game explaining that the Force Sword is the Chaos Breaker. Oh, and wondering, "Where the hell's Taros?" when I got to his shrine.

I didn't even remember there being a character named Ian, much less him having a relation to Kane, prior to spotting this thread. All the information about that which I remember is based solely on what's been posted here.
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Re: The Search For Kane's Baby Mama

Postby Caedmonball19 » Tue Nov 19 2013 6:49pm

Not a problem Domingo, thanks for wanting the most accurate information possible. It's fun to speculate on Shining Force history.
Does anyone else have potential information from Manga? I read over the Shining Soul translations and found nothing to even talk about there. (Before you say it Omega I know it's not canon :) )

EDIT:
Also read through the Shining Force CD games scripts and that was absolutely no help in this matter. I wonder if the Chronicle games they produced had any more information in them. Does anyone have access to these?
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Re: The Search For Kane's Baby Mama

Postby metateen » Wed Dec 11 2013 11:09am

Not sure if he has one but I'm certain he doesn't. Why? Well since if he is a time traveler then isn't she long gone? by now?~
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Re: The Search For Kane's Baby Mama

Postby Omega Entity » Wed Dec 11 2013 11:14am

Caed: The manga is... bizarre, to put it mildly. Though the manga is technically licensed by Sega, there is no official stance on it being canon, and really, the jury is still out on that. Some of the fanbase consider so, others cringe at the thought of it.

Metateen: Kane and Max weren't time travelers - they were cryogenically frozen. The only real time traveler was Mawlock in RotDD, who isn't canon in the slightest.
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(8:23:54 PM) YsFanatic18: She was feedigng horses
(8:23:58 PM) MXC0Spike: Barn sex
(8:24:07 PM) ahath714: She stuffs.
(8:24:39 PM) ehow1990: ask a stupid question and everybody has an answer XD


Any game I'm in should be considered a dating game.

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(8:23:54 PM) YsFanatic18: She was feedigng horses
(8:23:58 PM) MXC0Spike: Barn sex
(8:24:07 PM) ahath714: She stuffs.
(8:24:39 PM) ehow1990: ask a stupid question and everybody has an answer XD


Any game I'm in should be considered a dating game.

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Re: The Search For Kane's Baby Mama

Postby acsound » Thu Dec 12 2013 3:49am

Actually, while you're probably right per OJV canon, I had always thought that Max and Kane were descendants of the Ancients (like the people of Prompt) who were charged to be the legacy hero team: the Shining Knight Bros. (the way Link in each Legend of Zelda game is a different chara with legacy characteristics).
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Re: The Search For Kane's Baby Mama

Postby Omega Entity » Thu Dec 12 2013 5:38am

I think that assumption is what a lot of people made based on the official translation - if not that they were brothers, but that they were both connected to the Ancients, and obviously that they had known each other before the events of SFI (and pre-amnesia). But with the retrans, it not only spells everything out, but also also adds more depth, I think.
(8:23:45 PM) ehow1990: stupid question: why do you have hay there?
(8:23:54 PM) YsFanatic18: She was feedigng horses
(8:23:58 PM) MXC0Spike: Barn sex
(8:24:07 PM) ahath714: She stuffs.
(8:24:39 PM) ehow1990: ask a stupid question and everybody has an answer XD


Any game I'm in should be considered a dating game.

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(8:23:45 PM) ehow1990: stupid question: why do you have hay there?
(8:23:54 PM) YsFanatic18: She was feedigng horses
(8:23:58 PM) MXC0Spike: Barn sex
(8:24:07 PM) ahath714: She stuffs.
(8:24:39 PM) ehow1990: ask a stupid question and everybody has an answer XD


Any game I'm in should be considered a dating game.

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Re: The Search For Kane's Baby Mama

Postby DomingoRules! » Thu Dec 12 2013 6:36pm

acsound wrote:Actually, while you're probably right per OJV canon, I had always thought that Max and Kane were descendants of the Ancients (like the people of Prompt) who were charged to be the legacy hero team: the Shining Knight Bros. (the way Link in each Legend of Zelda game is a different chara with legacy characteristics).

OJV? :confused:
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Re: The Search For Kane's Baby Mama

Postby Omega Entity » Thu Dec 12 2013 7:16pm

Original Japanese Version. Took me a sec to figure it out too ;)
(8:23:45 PM) ehow1990: stupid question: why do you have hay there?
(8:23:54 PM) YsFanatic18: She was feedigng horses
(8:23:58 PM) MXC0Spike: Barn sex
(8:24:07 PM) ahath714: She stuffs.
(8:24:39 PM) ehow1990: ask a stupid question and everybody has an answer XD


Any game I'm in should be considered a dating game.

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(8:23:45 PM) ehow1990: stupid question: why do you have hay there?
(8:23:54 PM) YsFanatic18: She was feedigng horses
(8:23:58 PM) MXC0Spike: Barn sex
(8:24:07 PM) ahath714: She stuffs.
(8:24:39 PM) ehow1990: ask a stupid question and everybody has an answer XD


Any game I'm in should be considered a dating game.

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Re: The Search For Kane's Baby Mama

Postby Caedmonball19 » Thu Dec 12 2013 9:10pm

Glad to see the discussion continues....
Metateen - No matter if he is a time traveler or cryo frozen he still needs to have a baby mama to have an offspring.
ACSound - You could be right but we can't tell for sure where they are from. they may be from Prompt or maybe they were fighters recruited to original Shining Force that helped seal Dark Dragon for 1,000 years.

Omega - Yes OJV does spell out they were brothers, but again does not say where exactly they were from. They were trusted by the ancients at the very least to be chosen as the "Warriors of Light", given the swords to finish the job and given robots to protect them on their cryo-journey. Do we have scans of the Manga anywhere on the site? I saw a translation of some of it but its hard to follow without the pictures.
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Re: The Search For Kane's Baby Mama

Postby Omega Entity » Thu Dec 12 2013 9:39pm

I assume that they themselves were Ancients, as I believe all people of that time would be considered as such. Just because the descendants of the Ancients are all more or less contained in Prompt in the current day, doesn't mean that was true in the past.

I have the manga, and as it takes place after the game, it serves no real purpose in the current discussion.
(8:23:45 PM) ehow1990: stupid question: why do you have hay there?
(8:23:54 PM) YsFanatic18: She was feedigng horses
(8:23:58 PM) MXC0Spike: Barn sex
(8:24:07 PM) ahath714: She stuffs.
(8:24:39 PM) ehow1990: ask a stupid question and everybody has an answer XD


Any game I'm in should be considered a dating game.

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(8:23:45 PM) ehow1990: stupid question: why do you have hay there?
(8:23:54 PM) YsFanatic18: She was feedigng horses
(8:23:58 PM) MXC0Spike: Barn sex
(8:24:07 PM) ahath714: She stuffs.
(8:24:39 PM) ehow1990: ask a stupid question and everybody has an answer XD


Any game I'm in should be considered a dating game.

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Re: The Search For Kane's Baby Mama

Postby Caedmonball19 » Mon Dec 16 2013 10:45pm

I'm not sure I agree with you 100% Omega. I picture the term Ancients not meaning how some would take it as really really old people :) I think the Ancients were maybe the Einsteins of that time and not everyone was a genius of that caliber. There could have been native tribes that were very much un-Ancient like. Could have been groups that disagreed with what the "Ancients" were doing and would not want to been mentioned along side them. Maybe that makes Max and Kane even more special if they were not Ancients but rather from what would be considered a lesser class and yet they are the ones that save the world.

This is all speculation and dreaming but all this to say I don't agree that all people from the 1,000 years before SF1 would be called "Ancients".
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Re: The Search For Kane's Baby Mama

Postby Omega Entity » Tue Dec 17 2013 1:20am

A lot of people don't realize that SF1 is post apocalyptic - technology was the norm, not the exception.
I mean, think about it. You have Gates located on opposite sides of the world, as well as weapons. The laser eye, after all, was a technological excavation.

Also, there's never any mention of any ancient people other than the Ancients. So it bears to reason that the term 'Ancients' is a general term for all people who lived in that time.
(8:23:45 PM) ehow1990: stupid question: why do you have hay there?
(8:23:54 PM) YsFanatic18: She was feedigng horses
(8:23:58 PM) MXC0Spike: Barn sex
(8:24:07 PM) ahath714: She stuffs.
(8:24:39 PM) ehow1990: ask a stupid question and everybody has an answer XD


Any game I'm in should be considered a dating game.

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(8:23:45 PM) ehow1990: stupid question: why do you have hay there?
(8:23:54 PM) YsFanatic18: She was feedigng horses
(8:23:58 PM) MXC0Spike: Barn sex
(8:24:07 PM) ahath714: She stuffs.
(8:24:39 PM) ehow1990: ask a stupid question and everybody has an answer XD


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Re: The Search For Kane's Baby Mama

Postby DomingoRules! » Tue Dec 17 2013 3:01am

I think the term Ancients simply stems from the fact that people back then were so different from the modern day that they needed to be classified by scholars. When their world's technology was lost through means unexplained, that was the drastic end of an era. Referring to the people of that time as Ancients is likely just to differentiate their age from the one that came afterwards.
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Re: The Search For Kane's Baby Mama

Postby metateen » Fri Dec 27 2013 2:25am

Omega does raise an interesting point.

Looking at the time and age they are in does create questions about all the weapons that of the time of Dark Dragon and how the world was effected by it as well. Considering there tech could produce lazer eyes,flying mech pods, and Orbs that also shoot lazers(Those last two I'm not to sure of to be a bit honest) are from the ancient times.

Technology at that time was extremely advanced and we can just assume when Dark Dragon was put away some of his followers were disappointed with Dark Dragons expulsion and finishing the war they started with the forces of light knowing that the Darkness has fallen,without Dark Dragon on there side there victory was no longer assured.

So in the end the world would have to be healed by the weak forces of light that is taking over the clouds of Darkness the people would have to be weak, the ancient weapons being casted away and remain equal to those who lived among them but were now memories of the times that had happened before Dark Dragon and the war for light and Darkness to be fought. It took time as the ways of war were forgotten and the Light slowly had to eat away the Darkness and with the light hiding away the remains of the war weapons used during the war against the forces of Light and the Legions of Darkness.

Before I forget who is Kanes baby mama? Well as far as I'm concerned (At the moment,ask me again in about 30 minutes I will be in a better mood by then)it's someone Kane had to find attractive.
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