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The Minister

Discussion about this classic Genesis/Mega Drive game.

The Minister

Postby Cybel » Thu Mar 14 2019 9:53pm

Been replaying the game -- can't believe it's 24 years since I first picked it up. Just wanted to make a thread for the minister though -- surely the most underappreciated NPC in any Shining game. He's in the introduction, he's the last character Bowie speaks to, he sends Bowie on adventures... and yet he doesn't even have a character portrait! Always thought it seemed crazy that Talos and Zalbard got their own portraits when they were literally there for a boss fight and barely spoke instead of the Minister. Oh well, very belatedly, let's celebrate the Minister!
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Re: The Minister

Postby DiegoMM » Fri Mar 15 2019 2:16pm

Someone could make a minister portrait, so we can insert it on a mod.
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Re: The Minister

Postby DomingoRules! » Fri Mar 15 2019 3:36pm

It always bugged the hell out of me that the minister doesn't have a portrait. Same goes for Volcanon.

Also, I wonder if anybody else clicked on this thread expecting mention of the minister disregarding Astral's wellbeing after the gizmo incident as being inconsequential due to age, or if it was just me?
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Re: The Minister

Postby DiegoMM » Mon Mar 18 2019 9:35pm

Speaking...tires me.
Fighting...tires me
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Re: The Minister

Postby DomingoRules! » Tue Mar 19 2019 6:16am

My life feels more complete for having seen that.
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Re: The Minister

Postby Cybel » Tue Mar 19 2019 9:14pm

Fantastic!
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Re: The Minister

Postby DiegoMM » Tue Mar 19 2019 10:59pm

Plot Twist: Minister is a Lv 99 Green Vicar
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Re: The Minister

Postby Kilieni » Sat Mar 23 2019 4:27am

So now we have a face to go with "It doesn't matter if he dies, he's old anyway."
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Re: The Minister

Postby DomingoRules! » Sat Mar 23 2019 5:47am

A quote I never questioned as a kid because it made sense. Now I look at it and get the feeling that he was trying to say something cliché along the lines of how they shouldn't be sad if he dies because he lived a rich and full life, but worded it in the absolute worst possible way.

About a couple years ago, I played through this game alongside a friend who had never played it before, and his reaction to that line was definitely one of the best moments in the entire run.
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Re: The Minister

Postby Siel » Sat Mar 23 2019 7:42am

That line interested me again, so I looked up the Japanese script to see what it was like originally.

English localization:
Minister: Sir Astral is still sleeping... Is he alright?
The King is upstairs looking in on Sir Astral. I'm worried.
Sarah: Is he going to be OK?
Chester: We...we are...
Minister: He just fainted because he was exhausted by the two battles.
Don't worry about him. If he dies, it doesn't matter. He's old anyway.

Japanese original:
WARNING: SPOILER!

Rough retranslation:
Minister: Even so, this is quite the problem...
To think that Sir Astral, who we always could rely on, has yet to awaken...
And the King is worried about him and is still gone to check on his condition...
You kids must be worried too, right?
Sarah: Is Sir Astral really going to be OK?
Chester: We... are all so worried! Is his life in danger?
Minister: He appears to have only fainted after being significantly exhausted by the two battles.
Normally, there would be no need for concern... But, he is getting of age, after all.

So, it looks like that in the Japanese version, he comes off as much less coldhearted and he also actually addresses the Shining gang at the start.
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Re: The Minister

Postby DiegoMM » Sat Mar 23 2019 2:02pm

It makes a lot more sense.
I always feel like this was a mistranslation, because Astral is super important to Granseal, so the minister would be the last person to say something to lessen his importance.
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Re: The Minister

Postby Wiz » Sat Mar 23 2019 6:45pm

And here I am now, dreaming for a full re-translation project. :damnit:
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Re: The Minister

Postby Siel » Sat Mar 23 2019 7:37pm

The change in meaning might've been on purpose, but it could possibly also have been a mistake by overlooking the hypothetical "normally" line, which would've sensibly warped the remaining lines like so:

Normally, there would be no need for concern... But, he is getting of age, after all.

There's no need to worry. He's old, after all.

Don't worry! Because it doesn't matter if the old geezer croaks!
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Re: The Minister

Postby DiegoMM » Sat Mar 23 2019 8:39pm

Wiz wrote:And here I am now, dreaming for a full re-translation project. :damnit:


At last the main dialogue could be re-translate, since the full game would require a lot of people and effort.

But dialogue with slade in prison, dialogue with grater demons, volcanon, mitula, creed, etc should be enough to make a better storytelling experience.

Other fun part would be bookshelves re-translations, rescue all the japanese jokes that should be inside it.
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Re: The Minister

Postby Siel » Sun Mar 24 2019 8:52am

Well, I gave a shot at the jail scene. It's nearly the same in the grand scheme of things though, so my draft is basically just a more verbose version of the localization. Nevertheless, there were some minor differences, which I've bolded.

English localization:
WARNING: SPOILER!

Japanese original:
WARNING: SPOILER!

Rough retranslation:
WARNING: SPOILER!

In short, the more significant ones among these slight differences are that:
  • the soldier defends King Galam's character
  • the old man deduces something was sealed in the shrine instead of saying he already knows that
  • Chester states that someone's broken the seal instead of questioning whether it happened
  • the soldier informs everyone that Slade's awoken instead of addressing him right away
  • the soldier is the one to say Slade's friends are killed instead of Slade himself
  • Slade states he wants to avenge his friends
  • Sarah was satisfied by yelling at Slade
  • Slade makes an escape route instead of calling it a shortcut?
  • Slade accepts responsibility instead of claiming ignorance
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Re: The Minister

Postby Cybel » Sun Mar 24 2019 10:17am

Even if the Minister's line is a mistranslation, I don't really mind because it's a funny like that helps give him a lot of character. He's got a quite callous side to him as well -- when Bowie heads north, he has a line to the effect that the king thinks Astral's plan is to rescue Elis but that's not really his goal, suggesting that he's already written off the princess' chances.

As for Slade, thanks for the retranslation. I always think it's interesting that Sarah mentions Slade as a heroic kind of thief -- this isn't evident anywhere else and, for that matter, once they reach Parmecia I'm not sure Slade has any impact on the plot or characterisation to speak of at all. This is a shame given he starts the whole thing off and he's such a cool character. Just like they had villages/towns for the centaurs, elves and dwarves, I feel like it would have been interesting to have a thieves' village where we learnt a bit more about Slade.
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Re: The Minister

Postby DomingoRules! » Tue Mar 26 2019 3:33pm

Character development and moments for Slade would've been very interesting. I feel like he's one of the game's most important characters, being the one who started the whole mess, and it would've been cool to see him trying to make amends throughout the journey. Perhaps even having him replace Lemon in the final scene to finally put right the mistake he made.

He wouldn't have needed to be constantly around like Peter and Astral, but maybe have him present during key sequences that are relevant to Zeon and the main plot, like having him present when talking with Volcanon to feel the pain of the god's wrath alongside Bowie and Peter, then later apologizing to Mitula after the battle with Zalbard.
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Re: The Minister

Postby Sonson » Fri Mar 29 2019 6:51pm

Kilieni wrote:So now we have a face to go with "It doesn't matter if he dies, he's old anyway."


That line has always bugged the heck out of me every single time I play the game. Was that what he said in the original Japanese version of the game? It always seemed odd that anyone, let alone the minister of all people, would say something like that. Especially considering how respected Astral seemed to be.

Edit: And I apparently didn't read the entire topic
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Re: The Minister

Postby Cybel » Sat Mar 30 2019 7:04pm

DomingoRules! wrote:Character development and moments for Slade would've been very interesting. I feel like he's one of the game's most important characters, being the one who started the whole mess, and it would've been cool to see him trying to make amends throughout the journey. Perhaps even having him replace Lemon in the final scene to finally put right the mistake he made.


I'd wondered this as well. Although Lemon appeared early on, it was odd how important he suddenly became late on. Slade in this role would have been interesting. Then again, Lemon represented Galam and it accentuated the tragedy of King Galam to have his most loyal soldier take him down.

He wouldn't have needed to be constantly around like Peter and Astral, but maybe have him present during key sequences that are relevant to Zeon and the main plot, like having him present when talking with Volcanon to feel the pain of the god's wrath alongside Bowie and Peter, then later apologizing to Mitula after the battle with Zalbard.


If Peter had been dialled back a little bit, there was a lot of room for other characters to have speaking parts. Elric during the Devil's Tail sections, Higins in North Parmecia, Chester in Pacalon and Sarah and Jaha at any time. This was a great strength of SF3; even though the forces were smaller, the characterisation was much deeper and more consistent.
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